- February 15, 2012 at 4:30 pm #1644036
1. Norethern-Khmer Surin (diverged less than 200 years ago)
2. Western Khmer (Majority)
3. Standard=Phnom Penh
4. Cardamom Khmer=retains archaic vocal register
5. Khmer Krom
Did you know that back than in the Khmer language they actually pronounced the Final Rs at the end of words? (Ex. Today: KhmaE was originally: KhmaeR (which is still pronounced in Northern Khmer dialect retained in Thailand. Another example is the word Work (Kaa was originally KaaR. Now where can we listen to Cardamom Khmer speech with the original vocal register that has disappeared in other Khmer dialects. I wanna hear Khmer Cardamom speech, an archaic version of Khmer. Do people actually pay attention to how the Khmer lauguage is shifting, how we’re losing the R (not only have we lost the final R, in modern Phnom Penh we’ve already started losing “Rs”,period=and it’s spreading as the standard). Can anyone suggest a Cardamom Khmer video where a Cardamom Khmer speaks? Please and thank you. Hope this
exposed hindered changes/history in modern Khmer society.
[Message last modified 02-16-2012 01:10am by Kadin]February 15, 2012 at 4:32 pm #1644035February 15, 2012 at 6:45 pm #1644037
- Posts: 4395
Where does Radern fall into?February 15, 2012 at 6:58 pm #1644038
Rodern falls into northern Khmer
[i]Originally posted by JackTsang05[/i]
Where does Radern fall into?February 15, 2012 at 9:25 pm #1644039
pnohm peng dialect is not standard khmer, battambong is. the capital is full of chinese and viets who cannot roll R out of their mouths.February 15, 2012 at 9:57 pm #1644040
- Posts: 17
Standard normally means the area with the most educated and highest literacy rate, thus that is Phnom Penh and it’s the historical center of Cambodia since the fall of Angkor. Although Northern Khmer and the Battambang, and Siem Reap dialects probably resemble more of Middle Khmer but the areas has been under the influence of Thai and Lao for decades and a few centuries for Buriram, Surin, and Sisket in Thailand. Those dialects do and may have some Thai and Lao influences in pronunciations. In resembling Middle Khmer, however they resemble rural and uneducated social registers, not the way the upper class and royalty speak. Anyways, I have never heard how a Cardamom dialect is spoken, which is also spoken in small numbers in Trat, Chanthaburi, Sa Kaew in Thailand. I know my parents mentioned how they heard local Thais around the refugee camps in Sa Kaew speak in a weird Khmer dialect and it was probably Cardamom. Literacy rate is important in how a dialect is developed, if you can’t read then your pronunciations will be off. Khmer Surin or Northern Khmer, most do not know how to read in Khmer but write Khmer in the Thai alphabet so their pronunciation is off. Anyways I’m ranting, and I find it funny when Phnom Penher and Khet Kandal people count without the R sound, like I guess ‘regular’ Khmer would be m’roi or mouy roi, but Phnom Penher would be m’hoi.
[Message last modified 02-16-2012 06:00am by Noelle704]
[Message last modified 02-16-2012 06:03am by Noelle704]February 15, 2012 at 10:30 pm #1644041
hellocambodia thanks for bringing attention to the evolution of the khmer language, however, i am inclined to warn you that many sources pertaining to the khmer language, history, traditions, values, and beliefs are inaccurate, bias, prejudice and some times just plain made up. its B.S. these caucasian scholars of yesteryear worked with translators who were not proficient, not experts, and not always honest. any research from such a collaboration will always be flawed and should always be under scrutiny. khmer authors/researchers are not any better. they tend to make up things to romanticize their stories such as Luong Ung who wrorte First They Killed My Father .February 15, 2012 at 10:45 pm #1644042
pnohm peng was not the capital of cambodia after the fall of angkor in 1431. in fact, pnohm peng was not even a significant city until the french help developed it in the 18th to early 20th century.February 16, 2012 at 9:22 am #1644043
- Posts: 17
I’ve never said Phnom Penh was always the capital, I said historical center, and it’s debatable if it succeeded Angkor as a capital right after the fall, but Longvek and Odong did not become the capital right away either. Those historical cities are near each other and within the proximity of Khet Kandal, whose dialect is exactly if not similar to Phnom Penh. Well Modern Khmer is classified from the 1800s to the present day, and by this time Phnom Penh had gained its significant status, and that’s how it became the standard, the main dialect being broadcast by the media and language of governance.
Also Luong Ung is a historical fiction author, not linguistic.